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Codec AV1 Youtube 8K

(Topic created on: 07-01-2020 06:03 AM)
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Noirdog
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Hi all! Is there any chance to get the codec AV1 to play youtube 8K videos on the Q900R,Q950R,Q900RB? Like new Samsung models Q950T  presented at CES 2020 will be able to play 8K videos on YT, what about us owners of 2018 model? Thanks

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NCudmore
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@Noirdog wrote:

@NCudmore wrote:

-snip-

 


Hi, get in touch with the support and ask when they will plan to add this AV1 codec and let us know


Hi,

 

Just been on-line chat with Samsung and questioned about AV1 and YouTube as well as lack of DV Video (dvsd) and their support person called Joshua's response was "I understand. The TV will play 4K contents with applications that supports 4K videos quality. You may get in touch with YouTube customer support, surely they can explain why they can't support some TV models with 8K resolution."

 

I said that from what I've been told it is a Samsung issue, not YouTube not supporting AV1

 

He then went on to say "I'm afraid, this is not an issue with either the TV or the application provider, it is just that it is the application provider's discretion to decide what or which models they would support. You may get in touch with them, they can provide you further information about the services they offer regarding the resolution of YouTube they support."

 

So they are putting the blame on YouTube... :face-with-rolling-eyes:

 

I said "OK, so just to confirm you're saying that the lack of a common codec AV1 on the Q950 in this case is a YouTube issue and not Samsung?"

 

Joshua's response was "We have not heard about a codec needed for our TV to play 8K resolution in YouTube and we cannot provide any codec as the app developer is the only one who has control of their app's functions."

 

I got the feeling this was a bit like Mathew Broderick in Wargames trying to communicate with the computer Joshua, since his final word on the subject was "There is no issue with the TV and we have not heard from our engineers regarding this codec. The TV will only play 4K contents from applications that supports it and will play 8K contents from external devices that also supports 8K resolution."

 

thutch
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Classic first line support response to be honest... they don't really understand they issue and simply follow a script. We need to go higher, but not sure how this can happen - perhaps talk to a support manager? You can also email the Samsung UKI CEO which you can find on the "Contact Us" page
Jccrawfo
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That's a good idea- should we come up with some common wording to use so that they know we're all emailing about the same thing?

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thutch
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Oh and the 2020 models support the AV1 codec... the end device (Samsung) has to have the codec on the device in order to decode the packets being set over form YouTube... so it is a Samsung issue - again, shows lack of understand from the first line team in my opinion
thutch
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I wrote this to the CEO: 

 

I hope this email finds you well and you and your teams are keeping safe in this new world of lockdown for CV19.
 
I've literally just brought a 75Q950R 2019 TV from Samsung and from what I'm reading (by accident) your support forum post is telling me that this model of TV will never support the AV-1 codec required for streaming 8K content.   
 
Your website advertises this 2091 TV as a flag ship model, and with 8K I'd expect I'll be able to stream and game with 8K content in the future.  I've invested in this TV for that reason, based on the information on your website.
 
I'd suspect the majority of 8K content is likely to come from streaming services first, or certainly will be the content I consume the most for 8K as it's adopted... it would seem "fair" and "right" that the TV's sold as being 8K would actually support native 8K content as and when it's available.  
 
From my prospective Samsung, this is actually a serious mis-selling technique.  You can't advertise a TV to be 8K ready then in the small print (on a user community forum: https://eu.community.samsung.com/t5/TV/Codec-AV1-Youtube-8K/td-p/1492522/page/2) tell us that due to a hardware restriction you can't stream 8K codec using AV-1, a soon to be widely adopted open source 8K codec).  This is feels very naughty to me and I'd like an official response.  
 
1. Will AV-1 codec won't be supported for 2018/2019 8K models
2. Why isn't this made clear during a purchasing decisions
3. Will you be updating your website to change the language you use (this isn't a true 8K experience)
 
I'll wait for the response, then will report Samsung to the UK Trading Standards as I feel this type of behavior from a vender is unacceptable.  You've taken my money and now my TV is null and void for future 8K content.
 
Unfortunately this is the first time I've decided to "email the CEO" but after I invested in the 55ES8000 TV in 2012, the promise of 5 years of upgrade evolution packs came to nothing... I managed to get one and a few years later YouTube was unsupported and other apps were stuck on older interfaces and features (Netflix, Plex) and not fit for purpose in some cases.
 
I really want to expect more with my new TV purchase.  It's still a significant amount of money to spend but I've always believed that you invest into larger TV's and in this case a 2nd generation "8K" seemed like a good option.  Frustrated to read that the 2020 models of your 8K range now support the AV-1 codec which this model is missing, to stream 8K content.
 
I've also found that this TV doesn't support eARC which again is important to have for modern TV's to output next generation sound (inline with the Samsung next generation 8K picture).
 
I've 5 Samsung TVs in the house, so I'd count myself as a loyal customer and I'm really disappointed and feel let down by these events.  I'd really appreciate your view on this matter and how your teams at Samsung are going to help address these short coming in your 2019 flagship models.
Jccrawfo
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fantastic thanks!
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NCudmore
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To be fair here the lack of gigabit shouldn't be an issue even 8K won't max out a 100mb connection. I have Plex running on a Qnap NAS playing to the Plex App on the Q950r in 4K with 7.2 DTS playing fine, it's one of the things that did actually work fine over my first weekend with the set. I suspect your old Xbox One is buffering over your network better or something. I've got jumbo frames running on the NAS through the switches up to the One Connect box, which you might want to look at, as an option.

thutch
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Yeah I did think this as well about the 100mb nic as you said and thought it was odd... good advice on the jumbo frames, I'll have a look at this... I do have unmanaged switches thought (TrendNet) so it might not be so easy.
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NCudmore
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Taking your lead, I just sent the following to the CEO: -

 

I hope this email finds you well and hat you and your teams are keeping safe in this strange world of lockdowns due to COVID-19.

 

Friday, I took delivery of a brand new QE55Q950RBTXXU, and now wishing I hadn’t.

 

Having been drawn in by the promise shown on your website of your flagship TV with "The perfect reality of QLED 8K" and "True 8K resolution", I’m finding it sadly lacking.

 

As a replacement for a 5½ year old Sony 4K Android TV, I did hope to see this “perfect reality of QLED 8K”.  With no 8K content of my own to see, I turned to YouTube and 8K videos from there.  Having, previously started with 4K content to my Sony in the same way, I felt this was a fair bet to see the true nature of the new Samsung set with some immediately available 8K content.

 

Unfortunately, while I managed to find lot’s of 8K content to try and enjoy, on checking the best I could get was 4K on the set.

 

After initially thinking it lacked a software update, and then trying again I then resorted to your support forums, where I find that the set lacks the AV-1 codec required for streaming 8K content.   

 

Given that at present commercial 8K Blu-ray or whatever isn’t available currently, I'd expect the set to be able to stream 8K content, as this is one of the few methods of currently ‘seeing’ 8K content, and until a new 8K consumer format is released to ‘update’ from 4K, the reality is that the majority of 8K content is likely to come from streaming services first, following YouTube’s lead. 

 

Thus, since the TV's are being promoted and sold as being 8K it would seem to be only "fair" and "right" that they would actually support the only widely available native 8K content a consumer would have access to.  

 

As a consumer having to find out via https://eu.community.samsung.com/t5/TV/Codec-AV1-Youtube-8K/td-p/1492522/page/2) that due to a hardware/software restriction that I am unable to stream 8K content which uses the codec AV-1, extremely frustrating.  Especially given the fact that your website promotes YouTube shown in the screenshot https://www.samsung.com/uk/tvs/qledtv-q950r/QE55Q950RBTXXU/ it is not unreasonable to expect that it should actually work.

 

Given the lack of clarity on your website (oh and that’s actually in itself a breach of The Companies Act 2006 since it fails to display the Registered company number and registered company address), that aside I’d like a formal response to the following: -

 

  1. Will AV-1 codec be supported for 2018/2019 8K models, if so when?
  2. Why isn't it clear that streaming 8K content isn’t currently possible?
  3. Will you be updating your website to change the language you use (this isn't a true 8K experience) and to meet the regal requirements of the Companies Act?

 

I'll wait for the response, then if need be report Samsung to the UK Trading Standards. 

 

I understand that the 2020 model’s feature support for the AV-1 codec.

 

I really expected more with my new TV purchase, yet compared to my previous 5 ½-year-old Sony I find that ½ my existing 4K content that I shot/edited and the saved as AVI files won't even play, while my older 5 1/2-year-old Sony will play anything 4K and below.  Admittedly the only thing I was expecting it not to play was 3D footage and the odd 3D Blu-ray disks that I have (played on a Samsung 3d Blu-ray player), this is crazy in this day and age that a 5-year-old plus TV is more capable than a brand new 'higher spec.' TV.  So far while I admit the Picture is better than the Sony, it's only ‘plus' I see is the Apple TV app, there's seems far more capability on my Sony which I relegated to the bedroom.

 

Thus, I've also found that this TV doesn't support the older DV Video (dvsd codec) which has been around for several years.

 

I seem to of made the mistake of purchasing several Samsung devices now (Note 10+ which had a £200 price drop and free SmartWatch on offer before I even took delivery) and now this TV.  I'd really appreciate your view on this matter and if your teams at Samsung are going to help address these shortcomings in your 2019 flagship models, or if I should just give up and move to LG devices.

 

thutch
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Just had this response back...

 

Thank you for your recent email to the CEO of Samsung UK. I am sorry to learn of your dissatisfaction with the capabilities of your Samsung television.

While our department is not technically trained, following receipt of your escalation I have contacted our AV department to discuss. They have explained that while they acknowledge your view that this would have compatibility for future hardware, due to a hardware limitation this cannot support AV1 CODEC and was not advertised as such. Further to this, as this is in regard to future CODECs used by app providers to deliver 8K content – where it has not been confirmed by said app providers as to which CODECs will be used (AV1 or otherwise) – and as AV1 did not exist when the majority of the models in the range were being designed or finalised, it would not be possible for this to be known or accurately commented upon.

As you have mentioned that the main purpose would be for gaming in 8K, our AV team have explained that this is likely to be connected to your TV through HDMI and so may not require the AV1 CODEC.

All HDMI video CODECs are listed in the user manual for your television should you wish to review.

We acknowledge your comments with regard to eARC release and while we do not have any information on a timescale for release, your request been provided to the relevant teams for their review and to show that our customers are awaiting this release.

We appreciate you taking the time to raise this with us

 

 

So basically playing the " we didn't know when we designed the TVs" line... whilst I understand their point of view, not designing a TV which could support the upgrade of potentially new codec's is pretty *****.  AV1 was founded since 2015 and Samsung themselves were part of this consortium, it really shouldn't of been a surprise.

 

Whilst I don't get much use out of YouTube in the long run, I will from Netflix and Amazon and Apple TV... they offer me no assurances that these TV's will be able to deal with AV1 (or other new codecs) moving forward... or even the new 2020 TV's at that matter... perhaps the new 2021 or 2022 TV's would be the answer to get future support 🙂 

 

I've got soundbar which is now eARC ready but a TV which isn't... and a new 8K TV which can't actually stream 8K content... amazing