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iPlayer HLG/UHD HDR on Samsung’s J and K Series TVs

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So, of the nigh on 400 TVs supported in BBC iplayer for the Blue Planet II  HLG episodes none are from Samsung. Oh joy. 

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Moderator edit: Original thread title was "Blue Planet 2 HLG - No Samsung". With the OP's permission, the title was changed on 12/03/2018 to accurately reflect the dominant theme of the thread as it has progressed. If the reader would like to know more about the HLG format, please check out the BBC's page and FAQ's on it here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/projects/high-dynamic-range Thank you, AntS.

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@mrtickle wrote:

Samsung were dishonest about HDR10+, but it shouldn't be bitter now - because it turns out tat there is zero HDR10Plus content. NONE!

 

We've been hearing about it at trade shows for almost two years now - and yet, it's the only format with not one single downloadable demo in the entire world. Not ONE! But there are loads of Dolby Vision demos (pronounced "dole-bee" if you're American - yes I was shocked to hear it too). Because Dolby WANT you to see their format.

 

There have been several Samsung press releases claiming Amazon were streaming HDR10+, but they are all baseless. Amazon's own help page (https://smile.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=201648150&sa-no-redirect=1) says that "If your television is compatible, and the Prime Video title supports it, an "HDR10+" label appears instead of the normal "HDR" label in the video details.".

 

Not one user has ever seen that HDR10+ label appear in Amazon's app on their Samsung 2017/8 model TV

 

There is zero proof whatsoever that Amazon are streaming it, because both Amazon and Samsung are behaving badly:

1. Samsung refuses to update their 2017/2018 TVs such that, when it's getting HDR10+, it TELLS the viewer it is (a bit like that very annoying "an HDR video is playing" slide-down banner. Remember, this is a TV app NOT a HDMI input - so you can't use the "info" banner on the TV.

2. Amazon refuses to use the HDR10+ logo on the Info page for a programme, and the playback progess bar. 

 

So Samsung and Amazon deserve each other, quite frankly, and if either of them expect viewers to get excited about a format which they can't even tell the users they are delivering, they are deluded.

 

HDR10+ effectively is vapourware - so not at all worth getting upset about :smiling-face:

 

@UHDHDR, perhaps you could try out the Amazon Video app on this player which has the extra picture info? See if their brash and unlikely claims about streaming HDR10+ are true? I'd like to be proven wrong, because we'd have an actual answer. It may be the first way anyone can actually test if HDR10Plus is being output down the HDMI cable.

 


Unfortunately, the detailed info only applies to disc playback. I'll make sure to check all new Fox and WB discs from here on out though. If one of them have HDR10+, I should be able to verify.

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@mrtickle wrote:

Samsung were dishonest about HDR10+, but it shouldn't be bitter now - because it turns out tat there is zero HDR10Plus content. NONE!

 

We've been hearing about it at trade shows for almost two years now - and yet, it's the only format with not one single downloadable demo in the entire world. Not ONE! But there are loads of Dolby Vision demos (pronounced "dole-bee" if you're American - yes I was shocked to hear it too). Because Dolby WANT you to see their format.

 

There have been several Samsung press releases claiming Amazon were streaming HDR10+, but they are all baseless. Amazon's own help page (https://smile.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=201648150&sa-no-redirect=1) says that "If your television is compatible, and the Prime Video title supports it, an "HDR10+" label appears instead of the normal "HDR" label in the video details.".

 

Not one user has ever seen that HDR10+ label appear in Amazon's app on their Samsung 2017/8 model TV

 

There is zero proof whatsoever that Amazon are streaming it, because both Amazon and Samsung are behaving badly:

1. Samsung refuses to update their 2017/2018 TVs such that, when it's getting HDR10+, it TELLS the viewer it is (a bit like that very annoying "an HDR video is playing" slide-down banner. Remember, this is a TV app NOT a HDMI input - so you can't use the "info" banner on the TV.

2. Amazon refuses to use the HDR10+ logo on the Info page for a programme, and the playback progess bar. 

 

So Samsung and Amazon deserve each other, quite frankly, and if either of them expect viewers to get excited about a format which they can't even tell the users they are delivering, they are deluded.

 

HDR10+ effectively is vapourware - so not at all worth getting upset about :smiling-face:

 

@UHDHDR, perhaps you could try out the Amazon Video app on this player which has the extra picture info? See if their brash and unlikely claims about streaming HDR10+ are true? I'd like to be proven wrong, because we'd have an actual answer. It may be the first way anyone can actually test if HDR10Plus is being output down the HDMI cable.

 


Dolby vison is making strides unless there's huge incentive by Samsung HDR10+ is DOA

MSFT is going for DV

https://www.flatpanelshd.com/news2.php?subaction=showfull&id=1531372257

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@F1NNU.... I really love reading the BBC R&D Blogs. They're always so full of information and honest disclosure concerning failings, acheivments and future goals. Most heartening to read that 5.1 was supposed to have been delivered for these trials and that they're looking to support it in the future. If only all other tech companies offered such detailed disclosure as to how they were looking to support their customers' equipment rather than making them wait six months without any official word and then hitting them with a totally dismissive , virtual raspberry and a statement that offered no further information than had previously been given.

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Personally totally given up on Samsung TVs. I've had a JS8000 & KS9000 and had so many issues. This isn't an issue per se, but it's downright dishonest.

Latest fault I've come across is USB TV recordings don't work,and all Samsung could do is offer some guy a £50 Sainsbury's or Marks & Spencer voucher.
Current Samsung Devices:
65 Q9FN Tv
Galaxy Tab S4
Galaxy S10+
Gear S3 Frontier
Galaxy S9+
Galaxy Tab A 10.1
R3 speakers
Samsung cooker, fridge, microwave, DW
So much Samsung, so many problems...I'll learn one day!
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@ToonTonic wrote:
Personally totally given up on Samsung TVs. I've had a JS8000 & KS9000 and had so many issues. This isn't an issue per se, but it's downright dishonest.

Latest fault I've come across is USB TV recordings don't work,and all Samsung could do is offer some guy a £50 Sainsbury's or Marks & Spencer voucher.

With the recording issue, I had to push them and took 5 months. I went to the Samsung UK CEO, who replaced mt KS with a q9F which was very dull (and would not record) and they gave me a full refund. Samsung CEO office told me by email that the scheduled recordings not working was a known problem. You can record something your watching and it will do time shift so it's not the hard drive as some have said. It looks again as miss selling as its a spec advertised yet does not work and can not be fixed. Samsung has said it affects only a few TVs so they should be able to repair or replace. I think it affects all their newer models, but most owners don't use that function and use Sky or similar.

Paul

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Have you seen this article in What Hi Fi about the feedback from the latest Iplayer world cup 4K HLG tests? Very interesting in that it confirmed Samsung shafted their 2016 KS owners.

Manufacturer support

Another trending topic has been hardware support for UHD streams - and, notably, the lack of it on Samusng’s 2016 4K HLG-compatible TVs.

Samsung defended the situation with the following official response: “all of Samsung’s 2016 HDR TVs support HLG Broadcast technology (firmware update required). BBC UHD iPlayer however relies on a mixture of technologies, not just HLG, to enable its streaming of UHD content. Samsung has no plans to support BBC UHD iPlayer on its 2016 UHD TV Range.”

While the BBC couldn’t comment specifically on the Samsung situation, Layton did say this: “iPlayer needed very little modification to do UHD. All iPlayer does is play back the video object it’s given to play. The television is responsible for the decoding, for receiving the segments, and for picking the right ones according to the bitrate for the network. In terms of televisions, we don’t have anything specific in iPlayer, it simply relies on HbbTV and DVB underlying standards… those standards include DVB-DASH, it’s nothing BBC-specific.

“If a TV supports those, it works. There aren’t specific changes for UHD playback in iPlayer. Because it’s HLG and backwards-compatible, our criteria was: if a TV accepts a BT2020 signal and plays it back without interruption without buffering, we’d enable that device. What we don’t want is HLG on a 709 display because we don’t want it to look wrong.

“It’s up to manufacturers to choose how they support it, but we wanted our content on as wide a range of devices as possible, we didn’t want to limit it.”
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The article doesn’t really change anything though. We know the reason why BBC UHD isn’t supported on the KS tv’s is because they don’t support DVB-DASH, and this support cannot be added through a firmware update. It’s baked into the OS of the TV and for our TV’s to support it they would have had to use a newer version of the Tizen OS when the tv’s were developed.

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Quite! Bang on. In fact I've just typed a reply to that effect on the other thread where the same post was multiposted. Didn't realise it was here too :smiling-face:

What's good is that someone other than John Archer has said this. However, the very KEY part, DVB-DASH support, gets glossed over as if it's inconsequential. It wasn't :smiling-face:

 

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