HW-K650 and Two R1 Wirelss Speakers in 5.1 With KS7000 TV - Page 15

podavies · ‎07-12-2016

When using the K650 sound bar and two R1 Wireless speakers in surround sound mode over wifi with the latest firmware, The quailty of the sound K650 drops, sounds very muddy. As soon as you use the sound bar on it own, the sound bar improves. this is happening for a quite a few users.

can you help.

NotSamsung · ‎18-12-2016

Hi Lee,

I found a test file to test the 5.1 on the soundbar and 2 x M3 speakers. Perhaps Samsung should provide this file. or at least have in the Multirrom App a way to see if the Input sound is Dolby Disgital 5.1 (or stereo or DTS or mono) and state what the Soundbar is deliverying. The Sonos App has this.

My set-up:

TV: SEK-3500 - With the Audio Format (Output) set as PCM, HDMI Audio Format (Input) set as Bitstream)

Soundbar: K650

Surround speakers: 2 x Samsung M3's

My test results:
The (i) Optical connection gives me the same result as (ii) Connecting all via Wifi or (iii) Connecting via ARC (and wifi the 2 x M3's).
There are no benefit from Optical and need to use an additional remote to control the volume - the TV remote does not control the Volume (it does when I use ARC or Wifi connections).

All there tes cases do not play discrete sound in each speaker. The rear speakers get's a sound (but it is also played in the soundbar L and R albeit at a lower volume).

Bottom line is that I'm not convinced that Samsung can sell this as a 5.1 (3.1 Soundbar + 2 x M3's rear left and rear right).

The other issue could be that my SEK-3500 settings is incorrect.

The test I ran for these 3 connections all had on my TV (SEK-3500):

HDMI Audio Format (Input) = Bitstream.

Audio Format (output) = PCM.

Interestingly,

1) When I change the Audio Format output to DTS Neo 2:5, only the soundbar yields sound (the two rear M3's makes no sound). That is strange given that the SEK-3500 is suppose to take stereo and make it into 5.1 (albeit pseudo 5.1)

2) When I play a Netflix movie that is DD 5.1, the SEK-3500 gives me an option for Dolby Digital Audio Format. When I select this, the sound volume drops significantly and the center speaker (the voice channel) is so low I can't use or hear any dialog.

How can Samsung get away by selling this as a 5.1 system?

Please clarrify.

leelazer · ‎18-12-2016

Hi there. My system does give me true 5.1 over optical as it does some other members of this forum. from your message it seems you may think that I am a Samsung employee lol. I'm just another user trying to help other users. for the optical option to work the output via optical needs to be set to bitstream and not PCM. Your TV also has to be able to pass 5.1 from HDMI to its optical out, I know that the K series Samsung TV's can do this. Maybe that is why some of us can get true 5.1 while others can't.

Lee

podavies · ‎18-12-2016

I'm not sure where the mkv file is from I had someone email it to me. if you have a site where I can up load to I will

Bryantay · ‎18-12-2016

Trying to add a link to the MKV file that was sent to me...

Dropbox link here:

MKV File

Robbienobs · ‎23-12-2016

SAMSUNG YOU HAVE GONE VERY QUIET!

ANY UPDATE FOR US OR AT LEAST FINALLY ADMIT THERE IS A BIG PROBLEM HERE CAUSED BY A FIRMWARE UPDATE?????

Robbienobs · ‎23-12-2016

Hello all,

I have just received this response by email after I had asked for an update on the firmware fix:

"I have spoken with our community team and understand that there have been some positive movements with regard to this issue, is this not the case?"

I have responded but it is completely clear to me that a workaround with the optical cable is good enough for Samsung, and there is no real intention to escalate anything regarding firmware issues, let alone find a fix for the issues we have.

To date after months of attempting to get this sorted Samsung have still not admitted there is an issue.

I will be packing up my kit and taking it to their head office whether they want me me there or not!

NotSamsung · ‎23-12-2016

Thank you lee,

How do you know your system is gving you 5.1 over optical?

Mine does not. And below is how I know this.

I have a SEK-3500 (made in 2015 as the J series Samsung TV) and connected to the K650.

My TV can indeed pass-though Dolby Digital 5.1 from connected external HDMI Sources.

My TV can indeed pass-though Dolby Digital 5.1 from internal sources (Built-in APps, Media Player, USB).

The Samsung K series is the latest TV's. I would be surprised if these 2016 model TV's do not support 5.1 pass-through. Maybe the lower end 2016 Samsung TV's can't, but not the 8 or 9 series can.

Can you be more specific about the settings on the Samsung 2015 TV (the SEK-3500) for Optical to the K650 soundbar:

HDMI Audio Format (Input) = Bitstream.

Audio Format (output) = PCM.

Are you saying that I need to change the Audio Format (output) from PCM to Bitstream? That is impossible, because there is no Bitstream option. The only additional Audio Format (output) option that becomes selectable (when playing an internal source (e.g. Netflix movie is DD 5.1) is: Dolby Digital.

As stated before, I change this Audio Format (output) from PCM to Dolby Digital, but the sound is muffled compared to leaving it to PCM.

As stated before, when I use Optical to connect (and have teh TV settings to Audio Format (output) = PCM or Dolby Digital) then I do not get 5.1 when playing a 5.1 via the USB on the TV.

Obviously only 2 channel PCM is suppoted over Optical. But Optical can transport Dolby Digital 5.1.

Obviously only 2 channel PCM is suppoted over HDMI (ARC). But HDMI (ARC) can transport Dolby Digital 5.1. And HDMI (no ARC) can trasport multichannel (more than 2 channels) PCM, Dolby Digital 5.1., DTS 5.1, Dolby Atmos, etc. The respetriction comes in with ARC because of the bandwidth.

What I do not know is if the Samsung J series TV's (2015 models) support multichannel (more than 2 channels) PCM over Wifi.

That is because I can conenct the Soundbar (K650) to the TV via the TV's WiFi. When I do this, and play a test file via the TV's USB then I do not get discrete sound from each speaker.

How do you know your system is gving you 5.1 over optical?

NotSamsung · ‎24-12-2016

@Bryantay wrote:
Trying to add a link to the MKV file that was sent to me...

Dropbox link here:
MKV File

I don't do dropbox (they are not secure and was hacked before).

Can you perhaps put yoru MKV file on Google Dive or MSFT One Drive?

NotSamsung · ‎24-12-2016

@Robbienobs wrote:
Hello all,

I have just received this response by email after I had asked for an update on the firmware fix:

"I have spoken with our community team and understand that there have been some positive movements with regard to this issue, is this not the case?"

I have responded but it is completely clear to me that a workaround with the optical cable is good enough for Samsung, and there is no real intention to escalate anything regarding firmware issues, let alone find a fix for the issues we have.

To date after months of attempting to get this sorted Samsung have still not admitted there is an issue.

I will be packing up my kit and taking it to their head office whether they want me me there or not!

What is the workaround? Is it to connect the K650 via Optical to the TV and then to use the Samsung Multoroom App to connect the two sourounds over Wifi? It can't be because I tried that and I did not get 5.1.

Samsung should be more clear with what is supported over what TV connection (HDMI ARC, Optical, Wifi, TV Connect) and what the TV settings should be to achieve 5.1.

Furthermore, this could be a legal issue in that the K650 either works as designed, or does not work as designed. Based on the Samsung Marketing (product website), the K650 can do 5.1 when using 2 x Samsung Multiroom speakers. Why can't Samsung explain to its customers how to achieve this 5.1?

Surely Samsung knows the answer given that they designed the K650 Soundbar. Why should the we, the Samsung Customer, accept this ommision by Samsung?

I am yet to find any Samsung approved user material that explans how to get 5.1 sound from the K650 and 2 x Multiroom Samsung speakers. This is what we need to ask them. Because if their product does not work as designed or advertised, then they legally need to resolve the defect. That much is crystal clear.

And that is what is needed here. I want Samsung to provide me the Samsung User Manual how to set-up their equipment to achive 5.1 sound using their TV, K650 and 2 x M3's. That is what we need to ask them. It is that simple. And then, if it does not work, then it is either for them to fix it, or for us to make a legal case which they will lose and have to fix it.

I'm fed up testing their equipment and guessing how to do it. It should be an easy thing: Samsung advertises 5.1 with K650, this is how to set it up, boom there it works. But no, samsung can't even tell us how to configure their equipemnt to get the advertised 5.1.

The Optical 'workaround' does not work for me. Regrettably, however, I have no reason to accept the workaround even if it did produce 5.1 sound. I want to see their user Manauls that state connecting the K650 via HDMI (ARC) or Wifi to the Samsung TV would not give 5.1. I have not seem that, but have seen their ad for K650 and 5.1 sound, therefore can't just accept some non-working workaround.

Robbienobs · ‎24-12-2016

Hey NotSamsung,

Hopefully if they fix this issue with the firmware for full WiFi multichannel connection for surround mode you will be able to get the 5.1 they promised (it works now in fact but sound quality is useless).

Right from the start samsung have advised that to use the system with radiant speakers in surround mode, you need to use a full WiFi set up with no leads connected, and that when in wifi mode the leads do not input sound. I was told to set the tv up through its menu to use the radiant speakers as per the manuals, and this did work originally with 5.1, but again since the firmware update the sound quality leaves this setup unusable.

I have a K series tv and I am definitely getting 5.1 but using an adhoc workaround set up that someone probably found by experimenting, and is certainly not as advised by Samsung, which also leaves restrictions on using the tv volume control and is not a wireless system as advertised. Also its not as loud as it should be with this set up so it's definitely not a fix as Samsung appear to be hoping for; are you really stating Samsung that you think this issue is now fixed???

It is definitely not working as designed but it did out the box, but the most frustrating thing for me is the total lack of honesty from samsung, and still after all this time not admitting the core issues here with their firmware update.

Do you have a K series tv Not Samsung?

If so have you set the tv only to output on optical and not surround, and only then apply the surround mode through the app?