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iPlayer HLG/UHD HDR on Samsung’s J and K Series TVs

Big Cheese

Phil I now know you do not work for Samsung with your last post, and agree with every thing you say. It so obvious that Samsung do lie, as they emailed me saying they never informed anyone they would support any 2016 TV's. ***** it is word for word.

This is to acknowledge that we have already received your email, we do apologise for the inconvenience it caused you. Rest assured everything will be taken care of by Samsung.

 "In regard to your concern, Samsung doesn't formally filed any statement to any forums which include trusted reviews or any website that all 2016 UHD HDR TV will support HLG broadcast.  We were solely informed that no other legacy UHD TV’s are included. This service will not appear on 2014,15 or 16 models (HU, JU, JS, KU or KS). We are working closely with the BBC to enable our 2017 Samsung UHD models (MU & QE) only to access the service.

 We sincerely apologise for the inconvenience and thank you for understanding."

 

I like their asking me to thank them for my understanding, it's the opposite I am really not happy with Samsung, and like you said Phil, they can not even get it right between themselves, and I am even more sure they released this information of support, for marketing reasons only and were not truthful. This is a clear case of miss selling as even their 2017 models do not even work. I suggest you all look up the 2015 Oct European Consumer regs on google. They are written in plain English and it makes absolutely clear that if a manufacturer or retailer makes any claims about functionality or abilities or quality or responds to any of your questions about said item positively then that item must be able to do as said. If not it is miss selling, which is a breach of these regs, and you are entitled for a full refund. I think we may be getting close to a class action!

I was told by PC World when I bought the JS8000 that it was fully HDR compatible (my son was with me) and said that I was looking forward to watch Netflix HDR when they start broadcasting Marco Polo in the May. When it was broadcast my TV would not play the HDR version. At first Samsung blamed Netflix, Netflix told me that the TV was not compatible so Samsung then said it was because the TV was not HDR, which as we know it is! They would never admit it was their problem. I eventually got a full refund from PC World for miss selling under the 2015 regs.

I must have been mad to but another Samsung but the reviews were brill and the TV is very good, just wish Samsung sorted their support section and delivered on their promises!

I think the BBC response is excellent and again shows how poor Samsung are. I am waiting for ants (moderator) for his response, which should be interesting. 

I seem to have been blocked on their face book page, so also  use that to choice your concerns and also email Trusted reviews and What Hi Fi for their response, as I have done.

Paul

 

Superuser I
Superuser I

@Phil12 wrote:

@AntS wrote:

Hi all.

 

Official statement on the 2016 models:

 

“We are pleased to confirm all 2016 Samsung UHD TV’s have been enabled to support UHD HDR HLG content via TV broadcast as was promised (Ensure the latest software version is installed).

Please note this differs from that used by the BBC i-Player Online Streaming service and there are no plans at this time to enable it for 2016 devices.”

 

Regarding the 2017 range and Blue Planet II: "We are working closely with the BBC to enable our 2017 Samsung UHD models (MU & QE) to access the service."


Hi Ant

 

Could you please update us on this fiasco.  

 

Regarding the 2017 range and Blue Planet II: "We are working closely with the BBC to enable our 2017 Samsung UHD models (MU & QE) to access the service."

 

 

The statement above is now out of date as we know the BBC have removed every Samsung TV from the supported list, so what is happening exactly.

 

Regards

 

Phil


BBC actually say "Blue Planet II in UHD is available on BBC iPlayer on over 200 devices until 16 January 2018. If Samsung update their firmware in this timeframe, we can make the series available on these devices too."

 

However presumably it's not clear to the BBC if  Samsung can make the deadline which presumably is why no 2017 models are listed. Some folk (including myself) were informed they may  be  able to access 2nd week in January but the latest communication I had said it was not expected to be in time for current content on Iplayer,though deadline is a bit later than expected.  

 

Certainly would be good to have more detailed information on progress and how process has been held up though! Personally didn't know about any HDR from BBC when I purchased  TV but certainly may have been a factor lately, can get UHD and some HDR from other sources though myself.

Superuser I
Superuser I

Message seemed to disappear:

 

BBC say : Blue Planet II in UHD is available on BBC iPlayer on over 200 devices until 16 January 2018. If Samsung update their firmware in this timeframe, we can make the series available on these devices too.

 

However presumably not clear to BBC if Samsung can make deadline and therefore 2017 models have currently been removed from list. Some were informed may be able to access 2nd week of January, however latest communication I had said not expected to meet deadline but would be available for future content, though deadline seems a bit later than expected.

 

Certainly would be good to have further detail and just why processs has been held up! Personally purchased 2017 model due to UHD from other sources, didn't think there was a lot of HDR content at present and before I heard of the BBC trial. However, certainly would've been a factor for some lately.

Big Cheese

I know I keep saying it but Samsung said they would be fully supporting HLG in their 2016 TV's. Now as a customer it is not unreasonable to presume that would mean all flavours of HLG, UNLESS, they say that a particular type is not supported, i.e. Iplayer. Also when you consider that Panasonic TV's where able to show  the 20 sec HLG Iplayer sample in 2016 it is not unreasonable to think that the Samsung 2016 TV's would also be able to, when they had told the major reveiwer's (again they deny this) that the 2016 TV's would be fully supported, and you are being told this a premium product, state of the art and upto date, and will be kept that way with up dates! 

I must admit I watched the Hitmans Body Guard on a 4k Panasonic (not Samsung ) blu-ray player, with Denon Atmos surround and my 65KS9500 in 4K HDR.

It was absolutly stunning. 

I will give prise where it is due, and the sad thing is, it is the support and not keeping up with your rivals, that seems to let you down. To have all your models removed from the Iplayer list must be a little bit embarrassing to say the least!

 

Big Cheese

@Baulds wrote:

Thanks, yes 2017 I was worried I'd been sold a duffer lol. It's unbelievable that last years tvs have no plans to be upgraded. That's absolutely disgraceful. I used to work for mitsubishi electric and made vcrs. They kept their support division open in the UK for 7 years after the stopped making the video recorders for service and repairs, but Samsung can't or won't update software on a TV that's a year old. I think I should have went for the Sony TV I was looking at rather than this one as it appears it may be obsolete next month. 


Take it back and claim a refund for miss selling under the 2015 european regs in that you were told it wouls support HLG.

Explorer
There's a long list of hisence tvs in there. Aren't they cheap budget tvs from lidl or something? And the world's now largest electronics company can't compete with a cheapo brand.
Navigator

@Baulds wrote:

Thanks, yes 2017 I was worried I'd been sold a duffer lol. It's unbelievable that last years tvs have no plans to be upgraded. That's absolutely disgraceful. I used to work for mitsubishi electric and made vcrs. They kept their support division open in the UK for 7 years after the stopped making the video recorders for service and repairs, but Samsung can't or won't update software on a TV that's a year old. I think I should have went for the Sony TV I was looking at rather than this one as it appears it may be obsolete next month. 


No disrespect to you or you choice of TV but lets be honest, compared to say the KS range, the MU series are not that great as a HDR TV. They don't offer UHD Premium quality standards for example - not as wide a colour gamut or able to reach the Peak Brightness. The TV that matches the KS8000 (EU numbering) is the Q9F - both in terms of features, audio and HDR performance. In fact the KS8000 can give a higher peak brightness in a calibrated 10% window (not using some unwatchable 'Vivid' mode. Granted the Q9 has a small increase in the wide colour gamur but BOTH are Edge Lit, Quantum Dot layer (on the rear), UHD Premium quality HDR TV's. Only separated by a year in terms of release models yet the KS can't cope with a specific 'format' - according to someone *****, that format being the DASH-DVB.

 

As far as HLG support is concerned, there are a few 'youtube' test/demo HLG video's that clearly work on the KS8000 - ever since the youtube app was updated to support HDR playback. As there are external devices mentioned in the BBC HLG supported devices, I wonder if they will give you HDR when plugged into a KS8000? If the TV can't cope with the format used by BBC on its own, in built app, then maybe the option is that we watch it via some external device - I am sure it will work as the external will support that file and decode it - NOT that I think we should be forced to buy yet another device just to get the functionality that other TV's - inc those of the same and earlier generation can deliver. I can understand not supporting Dolby Vision, not wanting to pay Dolby for something that rivals Samsung's own HDR10 and HDR10+ formats they helped create but supporting media file extensions like HEVC and DVB-DASH should be included if not built in at launch.

 

What really gets to me though is the lies! Being told on via 'customer support' that the TV can't be updated because its not HDR1000, HLG won't work on any on-demand yet works via youtube or even that HLG was 'never' mentioned in any 'press' yet we can find numerous cases where it has been. I also recall that HDR10+ was mentioned as 'coming to at least the KS 2016 range' too but now Samsung seem to be backtracking.

 

I know £900 for a TV is a lot of money but the KS TV's were nearer £2k (55" KS8000 was £1.9k at launch but the 65" KS9500 was a lot more - Launching at £3.8k) and to see TV's like the MU series supposedly getting the update is ridiculous. Its not just that either as the 'competing' TV's to the KS - the most Popular of the UHD Premium TV's of 2016 - can cope with HLG via iPlayer yet the KS can't is ridiculous.

 

I know the 4k era has been quite an upheaval since the first 4k TV's launched. I bought a 55" HU7500 (nearly £2k) in 2014 - a TV that was promised woukd be 'future proof' by Samsung as they would keep it updated via Evolution Kits. The SEK-3500 was the last and not even 'officially - according to Samsung' released in the UK and then dropped completely. It was built with 4 HDMI 2.0 ports that couldn't be upgraded and only 1 supported HDCP2.2. I had no choice but to pay another £400 to basically get 4 HDMI 2.0a ports with HDCP2.2 support on all OR buy a new TV to get HDR with the wide colour gamut and decent Peak Brightness levels - that's how I ended up buying the KS8000 (beginning to wish I went with Panasonic DX902b or LG B6 OLED now...). It now seems that in 2018, another 2years later, I have a choice of going without HLG, maybe HDR10+ too OR buy yet another TV. This is absolutely ridiculous. Had I bought Panasonic or LG instead, I would not be forced into buying a replacement or missing out.

 

Its the combination of lies, quality control (or lack of), lack of support etc that has really hurt the most and I am certain that my 'next' TV will NOT be Samsung. I guarantee it will not be a back lit (either Edge or FALD) LCD that's for sure. I watch Nanosys with interest (I know Samsung are a major share holder) and the next step is Photo-emissive Quantum Dot layers which can be used with OLEDs too to increase their brightness and colour gamuts. The fact they have 8.3m dimming zones as EVERY Pixel can be 'perfect' Black (0.000000nits) and the Photo Emissive layer can increase brightness by up to 2.5x, this should take them over the 1000nits. LG also have a built in system for analysing HDR10 content scene by scene and adjusting the tone mapping algorithm - essentially adding in 'dynamic' metadata to static HDR10. OLEDs also have an incredible 0.5ms response time removing motion blur/trailing too. If I could swap my KS8000 for a B/C7 - I would!!!

 

As I said its not 'just' this iPlayer issue but a combination of factors over the past 4years - the fact I have spent nearly £4k on TV's - each with numerous issues - inc lack of updates, uneven backlighting, bleed/haloing, stuttering, sound issues (cutting out - often completely until you swap channels or source and back again), build quality (back coming off for example and very inconsistent panel quality - just look on AVForums or AVS Forums at 'customer issues' with Samsung in the last few years - let alone their phones), game mode implementation and lack of HDR Game mode, poor customer service with poor/inaccurate or just lies in the information given out by these etc etc - I could go on...

 

I have owned countless TV's over the years and currently have 2 TV's - both Samsung. My 2nd is a 48H6400 but in the last 10years or so, I have always had at least 1 Samsung. I have also had Samsung microwaves, fridges (still have these btw), phones etc but the issues I have had in the last 4yrs has been enough to last me a lifetime and as I am 'stuck' with my increasingly outdated KS8000 that's not even 18months old, I really can't see myself buying another Samsung - at least not a high-end product again! Its unacceptable - especially considering the upcoming threat from TCL and LG & Sony making big inroads into narrowing Samsungs domination in the TV market share. You would expect much better, ensure great customer satisfaction to ensure their 'next' purchase would be Samsung.

Voyager
Hi

Yes HiSence TVs are a cheap brand, and they may support HLG but whether that translates to an actual HDR picture to the eye is another thing entirely of course. Hisence TVs will be using silicon from Amlogic or similar and these chips just come with support as standard.

Samsung TVs do support HLG, the issue is they can't play the BBC streams, possibly something to do with DVB-DASH not working correctly, this also means they can't play BBC iPlayer streams in 4K SDR either as we don't get that as a fall back.

We do know that the BBC has tested some firmware and seen it working from Samsung to initially get on the list, but we don't know what this firmware was. Was it full production firmware ready to go and now it's been stalled because it's failed testing in some area? Or was it some special cut down test firmware that just ran the iPlayer app to enable 4K HDR to get the BBC to add them to the list, and those changes now need to somehow be added to the full firmware which could take ages or be problematic to do? Without any information from Samsung we just don't know.

It's embarrassing for Samsung that is for sure, and it is just being made worse by them not having say anything concrete or letting people know what his happening.

Regards

Phil



Big Cheese

I do feel for you as I have a 2016 KS9500 and paid over £3000, for a top quality future proof premium TV. How wrong I was! As to not having a HDR1000 as the reason for no Iplayer HLG, mine is HDR1000 and no Iplayer support. Thing is Phil when you pay this amount of money you expect it to be able to match it's rivals, especially when they said they would!

Big Cheese

Phil the thing is they (Hisence) do support Iplayer HLG and Iplayer 4K which our top of the range TV's do not!!!!!!!!!!!

Is that Right???????????????????????

Can someone from Samsung aanswer that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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