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iPlayer HLG/UHD HDR on Samsung’s J and K Series TVs

(Topic created on: 11-06-2018 05:44 PM)
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ewanstancarr
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So, of the nigh on 400 TVs supported in BBC iplayer for the Blue Planet II  HLG episodes none are from Samsung. Oh joy. 

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Moderator edit: Original thread title was "Blue Planet 2 HLG - No Samsung". With the OP's permission, the title was changed on 12/03/2018 to accurately reflect the dominant theme of the thread as it has progressed. If the reader would like to know more about the HLG format, please check out the BBC's page and FAQ's on it here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/projects/high-dynamic-range Thank you, AntS.

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jordanwebbo90
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Great news that the Roku has been added to the list.

 

Just ordered myself one for £45 from CEX, will probably sell it again after the World Cup.

 

link if anybody else is interested, slightly cheaper than Amazon and is condition A - Product in mint/new condition with original box and all original accessories:

https://uk.webuy.com/product-detail?id=0829610002217a&categoryName=tv%20media%20players&superCatName...

 

dunwell
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Thanks ever so much @tarbat for the comparison write up. Really pleased about the SS+ for the World Cup. 

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blenky
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@UHDHDR wrote:

@tarbat wrote:

@mrtickle wrote:

Thanks @tarbat.

So just to clarify, case (2) is iPlayer app running in your Roku Stick+ , with its HDMI output going into one of the HDMI inputs on your KS8000 (via the HDFury) - with the HDFury just monitoring the data, ie no changes made at all to the EDID on the TV?


No. Case 2 was a direct connection from the Roku Stick+ into HDMI2 on the KS8000 TV.  Also tested connected to HDMI3 on my Yamaha YSP-2700 sound bar.  In both cases the HLG football loop played okay.

 

One thing I would say comparing the Roku iPlayer app and the iPlayer app on my MU6400 TV. When playing the HLG loop and then accessing the iPlayer menus, the picture flickers a lot and is very washed out.  On the MU6400, doing the same has no flickering and a good view of the iPlayer menus.


Interesting. So then the Roku Stick+ can correctly display HLG via HDMI on the 2016 KS series TV (just like the Samsung M9500/M8500/M7500 and Oppo 203/205) without requiring an HDFury. 

 

Good news.


I think that was determined awhile ago. The uncertainty was whether it would be on the trial

UHDHDR
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@blenky wrote:

@UHDHDR wrote:

@tarbat wrote:

@mrtickle wrote:

Thanks @tarbat.

So just to clarify, case (2) is iPlayer app running in your Roku Stick+ , with its HDMI output going into one of the HDMI inputs on your KS8000 (via the HDFury) - with the HDFury just monitoring the data, ie no changes made at all to the EDID on the TV?


No. Case 2 was a direct connection from the Roku Stick+ into HDMI2 on the KS8000 TV.  Also tested connected to HDMI3 on my Yamaha YSP-2700 sound bar.  In both cases the HLG football loop played okay.

 

One thing I would say comparing the Roku iPlayer app and the iPlayer app on my MU6400 TV. When playing the HLG loop and then accessing the iPlayer menus, the picture flickers a lot and is very washed out.  On the MU6400, doing the same has no flickering and a good view of the iPlayer menus.


Interesting. So then the Roku Stick+ can correctly display HLG via HDMI on the 2016 KS series TV (just like the Samsung M9500/M8500/M7500 and Oppo 203/205) without requiring an HDFury. 

 

Good news.


I think that was determined awhile ago. The uncertainty was whether it would be on the trial


After reading about the first come first serve limitation, it doesn't matter much anyways. They will be offering 4K HDR to less than 5% of viewers, and probably closer to 1-2%. The odds of actually being able to stream this in UHD, even if you have a proper setup, will be minuscule. 

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rozel
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@UHDHDR wrote:

Were you guys aware of the restrictions on viewing this in 4K HDR?

>>>>>>All 29 of BBC One's World Cup matches are scheduled to be made available in 4K and HDR.

But each will be limited to "tens of thousands of people" - the exact number of iPlayer-equipped devices has not been specified in advance.

To gain access, viewers must be among the first to click on the relevant home screen button just after each stream starts.<<<<<<<<

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-44308154


That sounds kind of lame.


Yes I  think it may well be darn near impossible.   If I'm successful in getting a signal,  I'll wager my wifi won't be strong enough to get the best picture quality

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JTE
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My comment was not personal towards any individual but rather a generalisation about the direction this thread appears to be going. I have a Panasonic Blu-ray play which may or not at some point offer BBC iPlayer HLG solution. I don’t understand why HLG cannot be converted to a HDMI feed my TV supports but what I do know is Samsung have let me badly down with a TV that was supposed to be future proofed.

jordanwebbo90
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@rozel wrote:

@UHDHDR wrote:

Were you guys aware of the restrictions on viewing this in 4K HDR?

>>>>>>All 29 of BBC One's World Cup matches are scheduled to be made available in 4K and HDR.

But each will be limited to "tens of thousands of people" - the exact number of iPlayer-equipped devices has not been specified in advance.

To gain access, viewers must be among the first to click on the relevant home screen button just after each stream starts.<<<<<<<<

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-44308154


That sounds kind of lame.


Yes I  think it may well be darn near impossible.   If I'm successful in getting a signal,  I'll wager my wifi won't be strong enough to get the best picture quality


Same. I only get about 25mb on my connection so I’m only expecting 1440p, this plus HLG should still be a decent improvement over the standard 1080i broadcast.

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tarbat
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Useful info. on the bitrates BBC will be using.  From http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/blog/2018-05-uhd_hdr_world_cup_2018

 

For the World Cup they will be offering:

3840x2160p50   36Mbit/s

2560x1440p50   16Mbit/s

1920x1080p50   10Mbit/s

1280x720p50      7Mbit/s

The audio will be stereo AAC-LC at 128 kbit/s

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dunwell
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I don't agree that the odds will be miniscule.

 

This HDR feed is only available to those with a supported television or a Roku SS+

 

How many people now with HD equipment still don't even watch the HD channel? We know this to be a significant proportion.

 

How many people do you think, rather than watch it on their main aerial / sky / cable feed will choose to use the connected app of the iPlayer instead? I'd wager hardly any, except those who are desperate to watch in HDR (if they even know what that is) I'd be surprised if the figure even reached into 5 figures for some matches.

mrtickle
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@tarbat wrote:

@dunwell wrote:

Question for @tarbat - can you see any noticeable differnce in the PQ of the HLG football loop test clip between the KS and MU televisions when using the SS+? (Not counting the flickering menus)


Yes.  The picture on my KS8000 in HLG mode was much better than on the MU TV.  On the MU TV I really wasn’t all that impressed, whereas on the KS8000 it was bright and vibrant.  [...]

 

EDIT: I'm guessing the lack of "Smart LED" function on the MU TV, and a lower peak brightness, and not being spec'ed to HDR1000 is why the MU is underwhelming!!!

1.jpg 

 

 

It's not just the lack of "Smart LED" (partial backlight dimming) - it's much more fundamental! The 2017 "MU" series were a huge step DOWN from the 2016 "KS" series. The 2016 "KS" were in Samsungs "SUHD" range.

Below that, was the 2016 "UHD" range. (KU66, KU65, KU64, KU61, KU60).

 

The 2017 "MU" series are the equivalent of the 2016 "KU" series, the range BELOW the KS. Not even "SUHD" models.

see Very nice table at the bottom of this page - use the radio buttons.

They had HDR "support" but didn't meet the UHD Premium spec. No 1000 nits here!

No Quantum Dots so no wider colour gamut than any other LED-LCD panel.

Not a 10bit panel! They were 8bit + FRC [Google: "FRC is a form of temporal dithering which cycles between different color shades with each new frame to simulate an intermediate shade". Ie it flashes between colours to simulate the in-between colour that it physically can't display]

 

 

In short, the MU were in no way comparable to the KS. The equivalent of the KS SUHD range were the "QLED" series.

 

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