iPlayer HLG/UHD HDR on Samsung’s J and K Series TVs

[ewanstancarr]

So, of the nigh on 400 TVs supported in BBC iplayer for the Blue Planet II  HLG episodes none are from Samsung. Oh joy. 

...

Moderator edit: Original thread title was "Blue Planet 2 HLG - No Samsung". With the OP's permission, the title was changed on 12/03/2018 to accurately reflect the dominant theme of the thread as it has progressed. If the reader would like to know more about the HLG format, please check out the BBC's page and FAQ's on it here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/projects/high-dynamic-range Thank you, AntS.

[paul1111]

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@dunwellwrote:
It isn't only pay tv services though - perfectly feasible to believe that a 4K, HDR able iPlayer app will be available on all number of devices or streaming sticks via HDMI. Many of these devices fall to to £30 mark relatively quickly, surely that is the overarching ambition here, that the EDID issue is fixed and 4K HDR / HLG is fully implementable over HDMI.

My view again, for what it's worth, is that the iPlayer issue is only one part of a much more important jigsaw.

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May I ask what happens if Samsungs do not fix the EDID issue?  I find it odd that Samsung have not all ready fixed this issue of it was easy to do and that would stop some of these concerns. 

[BAMozzy]

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@TastyBurger666wrote:

Forbes have updated their article... seems the official word is we definitely WON'T be getting iplayer 4k app support.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarcher/2018/02/23/samsung-confirms-no-bbc-iplayer-hdr-support-for-i...

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This changes nothing - nothing we didn't know months ago. This is one of the MAIN reasons we started looking at alternative methods of getting iPlayer HLG and that was very dependent on whether HLG would work over HDMI in particular. With a lack of actual HLG iPlayer devices, its been difficult - especially with some being too ignorant to make the connection that if HLG works with 'x, y and z' devices over HDMI, there is almost a guarantee that some external devices will be able to offer BBC iPlayer HLG - like SkyQ for example as a HDMI option or even Amazon Fire Stick as a USB option in the future.

It was clear that these 2016 (and older TV's) were going to come up against issues with newer technology. Its no different from the first few years of 4k TV's before even HDR became a 'thing'. No amount of Evolution Kits or software updates would ever enable these TV's to deliver HDR10 quality, certainly not HLG, DV or HDR10+.

Of course I would have prefered some more 'positive' resolution - these TV's to be updated with the latest Tizen so they can cope with the UHD and HLG iPlayer App rather than have to buy an external device or open up a STB subscription - who knows - maybe a freeview box will offer UHD HLG iPlayer apps so no subscription is needed. However, IF Samsung can fix the EDID issue which, according to some is supposed to be in the works, then the TV should be able to play UHD HLG iPlayer - albeit from an external device - something many of us have been saying for months yet others are still being very argumentative and 'aggressive' about. Its not the 'perfect' outcome but it would still be better than nothing. Just because the inbuilt Smart Apps are likely to be 'dated' doesn't mean that alternatives on external devices won't work. Again, not ideal but likely to be a LOT cheaper than a £400+ new 'OCB' (Evolution Kit) that does the same as an EDID update and an external £30-40 external device will do - maybe not as 'neat' as having an in-built app but it should still offer the same UHD HLG iPlayer content...

[mrtickle]

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@TastyBurger666wrote:

Forbes have updated their article... seems the official word is we definitely WON'T be getting iplayer 4k app support.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarcher/2018/02/23/samsung-confirms-no-bbc-iplayer-hdr-support-for-i...

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Thankyou for alerting us to the change. However that's not really an update as far as I can see. The new paragraph at the top claiming that he's updated his article, contains more new words than anything he's added in the body of the article!!!!

It's almost identical to before.

It's still not an official Samsung statement or press release.

There's still nothing on Samsung's website about it.

There's still no named person from Samsung on the record giving a statement about it.

Until I see a NAMED PERSON FROM SAMSUNG, giving a statement on a Samsung website, it's not "official".

@IMPORTANT: like before, I still believe that John Archer is correct, and I'm still just as angry at Samsung's broken promse. But please, please, do not say that things on his website are the "official" word of Samsung: they are not, as @Ant has explained.

[paul1111]

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@BAMozzywrote:

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@TastyBurger666wrote:

Forbes have updated their article... seems the official word is we definitely WON'T be getting iplayer 4k app support.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarcher/2018/02/23/samsung-confirms-no-bbc-iplayer-hdr-support-for-i...

---

This changes nothing - nothing we didn't know months ago. This is one of the MAIN reasons we started looking at alternative methods of getting iPlayer HLG and that was very dependent on whether HLG would work over HDMI in particular. With a lack of actual HLG iPlayer devices, its been difficult - especially with some being too ignorant to make the connection that if HLG works with 'x, y and z' devices over HDMI, there is almost a guarantee that some external devices will be able to offer BBC iPlayer HLG - like SkyQ for example as a HDMI option or even Amazon Fire Stick as a USB option in the future.

It was clear that these 2016 (and older TV's) were going to come up against issues with newer technology. Its no different from the first few years of 4k TV's before even HDR became a 'thing'. No amount of Evolution Kits or software updates would ever enable these TV's to deliver HDR10 quality, certainly not HLG, DV or HDR10+.

Of course I would have prefered some more 'positive' resolution - these TV's to be updated with the latest Tizen so they can cope with the UHD and HLG iPlayer App rather than have to buy an external device or open up a STB subscription - who knows - maybe a freeview box will offer UHD HLG iPlayer apps so no subscription is needed. However, IF Samsung can fix the EDID issue which, according to some is supposed to be in the works, then the TV should be able to play UHD HLG iPlayer - albeit from an external device - something many of us have been saying for months yet others are still being very argumentative and 'aggressive' about. Its not the 'perfect' outcome but it would still be better than nothing. Just because the inbuilt Smart Apps are likely to be 'dated' doesn't mean that alternatives on external devices won't work. Again, not ideal but likely to be a LOT cheaper than a £400+ new 'OCB' (Evolution Kit) that does the same as an EDID update and an external £30-40 external device will do - maybe not as 'neat' as having an in-built app but it should still offer the same UHD HLG iPlayer content...

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How ignorant are you for calling people on here ignorant for asking reasonable question. I know you are the expert here but you still have not told me of any other device apart from the Samsung disc player that can send hlg over HDMI. If Samsung do not update the EDID where does that leave ks TVs? Will there be any device that can send a hlg signal to the ks.  If the iplayer hlg is an European standard where does that leave the ks? 

Sorry for being ignorant and stupid,  I am just asking a question not insulting users here! 

[TastyBurger666]

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@mrticklewrote:

@IMPORTANT: like before, I still believe that John Archer is correct, and I'm still just as angry at Samsung's broken promse. But please, please, do not say that things on his website are the "official" word of Samsung: they are not, as @Ant has explained.

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Wowwww, you lot! Shoot the messenger, why don't you?

I've asked John about the questions over his credibility on twitter. See what he says.

[dunwell]

For goodness sake Paul, you are the worst out of all of them. Let's not start this circular nonsense again, we all know the state of play with this, there is no new information, we even know (EDID) what needs to happen to get us to a 'good' resolution with all of this. I hold your highly emotive and temperamental posts to be the main reason this thread has been closed twice in the last ten days. Let's not go through all that again please - we should await the outcome of any fixes to the overarching changes required to enable HDMI support.

[paul1111]

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@dunwellwrote:
For goodness sake Paul, you are the worst out of all of them. Let's not start this circular nonsense again, we all know the state of play with this, there is no new information, we even know (EDID) what needs to happen to get us to a 'good' resolution with all of this. I hold your highly emotive and temperamental posts to be the main reason this thread has been closed twice in the last ten days. Let's not go through all that again please - we should await the outcome of any fixes to the overarching changes required to enable HDMI support.

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I am asking the experts like you what will be the outcome be if Samsung do not update the EDID?  What is wrong with with that? Have I called anyone here ignorant?  I have also asked what devices that some keep on saying will pass through hlg over hdmi,  and still the only one that someone has said works is a "Samsung " player.  It seems if you criticize samsung you seem to get shot down here. 

[hdmi]

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@BAMozzywrote:

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@TastyBurger666wrote:

Forbes have updated their article... seems the official word is we definitely WON'T be getting iplayer 4k app support.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarcher/2018/02/23/samsung-confirms-no-bbc-iplayer-hdr-support-for-i...

---

This changes nothing - nothing we didn't know months ago. This is one of the MAIN reasons we started looking at alternative methods of getting iPlayer HLG and that was very dependent on whether HLG would work over HDMI in particular. With a lack of actual HLG iPlayer devices, its been difficult - especially with some being too ignorant to make the connection that if HLG works with 'x, y and z' devices over HDMI, there is almost a guarantee that some external devices will be able to offer BBC iPlayer HLG - like SkyQ for example as a HDMI option or even Amazon Fire Stick as a USB option in the future.

It was clear that these 2016 (and older TV's) were going to come up against issues with newer technology. Its no different from the first few years of 4k TV's before even HDR became a 'thing'. No amount of Evolution Kits or software updates would ever enable these TV's to deliver HDR10 quality, certainly not HLG, DV or HDR10+.

Of course I would have prefered some more 'positive' resolution - these TV's to be updated with the latest Tizen so they can cope with the UHD and HLG iPlayer App rather than have to buy an external device or open up a STB subscription - who knows - maybe a freeview box will offer UHD HLG iPlayer apps so no subscription is needed. However, IF Samsung can fix the EDID issue which, according to some is supposed to be in the works, then the TV should be able to play UHD HLG iPlayer - albeit from an external device - something many of us have been saying for months yet others are still being very argumentative and 'aggressive' about. Its not the 'perfect' outcome but it would still be better than nothing. Just because the inbuilt Smart Apps are likely to be 'dated' doesn't mean that alternatives on external devices won't work. Again, not ideal but likely to be a LOT cheaper than a £400+ new 'OCB' (Evolution Kit) that does the same as an EDID update and an external £30-40 external device will do - maybe not as 'neat' as having an in-built app but it should still offer the same UHD HLG iPlayer content...

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Just out of curiosity what BBC is using for HD/SDR content, if not DVB-DASH

[dunwell]

(1) I'm not an expert. Everything I know, I've learned from this (and the Sky Q) thread and I'm extremely grateful for those who know more than me for the amount of time they have spent patiently explaining this technology.

(2) I think it's pretty obvious what will happen if EDID does not get fixed - HDR from external sources (Satellite boxes, streaming sticks etc) will not work for us KS TV owners.

(3) You called someone ignorant in your previous post!

(4) Plenty here have been critical of Samsung without being shot down. Everyone here has a right to be critical about the iPlayer debacle but the bigger picture needs to be kept in mind. If they don't ever fix EDID then the full spectrum or criticism will be entirely justifiable

(5) You get shot down because whilst you think that you are "just asking"; your questions often come across as aggressive, critical, hyper-sensitive and rude. It just isn't necessary, particularly when 90% of the time the things you are "just asking" about have been answered multiple times over in this and the other thread.

This isn't meant to be a personal attack (it isn't really, I'm sure you're a perfectly nice person) but I just want to reflect back to you what I'm sure many other forum users like me are frustrated about with some of the discourse over recent weeks.

[BAMozzy]

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@paul1111wrote:

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How ignorant are you for calling people on here ignorant for asking reasonable question. I know you are the expert here but you still have not told me of any other device apart from the Samsung disc player that can send hlg over HDMI. If Samsung do not update the EDID where does that leave ks TVs? Will there be any device that can send a hlg signal to the ks.  If the iplayer hlg is an European standard where does that leave the ks? 

Sorry for being ignorant and stupid,  I am just asking a question not insulting users here! 

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Not ignorant at all - maybe getting rather fed up and frustrated with others who have no idea what they are talking about, what this means and yet again having to re-iterate that the state of play is NO different from how it was a week ago, a month ago etc and that the situation won't change until either Samsung do or do not update the EDID issue. As you were keen to shout, that may not even happen until next month (although that is SPECULATION from a user and NOT official). The fact that I am fully aware that this changes 'nothing' and that nothing will change unless Samsung make an official statement regarding EDID fix or just update it, then how can I be ignorant? I am fully aware of the situation!

As ALL of this has been stated to you MANY times and this news Article 'update' hasn't changed ANYTHING. Certainly NOTHING that should have resulted in you getting on your soapbox and trying to rally others onto your personal crusade, certainly nothing that requires you to yet again go over things that have been stated many times before. Unless or Until we get an update to fix the EDID, then chances are, most (if not all - unless some will send HLG regardless of knowing whether the TV can handle it or not) external devices will not work as intended. How is that any different to what was know last week? How as some slight 'clarification' on a article suddenly thrown everything up in the air again? What has actually changed that you need to get so worked up over yet again? Both the original text and update state that the 2016 (and older TV's) cannot play the HLG (or even UHD but that doesn't mean that the TV isn't 4k enabled) iPlayer app and wouldn't be able too. All its clarified is that the reason is not necessarily just HLG related but related to the App. You can't put a PS4 disc in an XB1 and expect it work - point is, the App is not compatible with the Tizen OS in our TV's which was already known and this is just saying the same thing.