Re: KS Owners refund - Page 139

paul1277 · ‎24-12-2017

Do all you good people who bought a 2016 Samsung TV know Samsung have stopped supporting it. The promised they would support HLG (BBC Iplayer HDR). This was in the Dec 2016 Trusted Reviews and What Hi Fi. They have not and if you had bought a Panasonic or LG 2016 set you would be able to watch Iplayer Blue Planet 2 in glorious HLG. This is a big issue because HLG looks like the standard for all over the air broadcasting. Samsung are not even supporting a 4K update to Iplayer. The reason looks like it will cost just 5 cents or pence per unit. So my telly I bought in Jan 2017 is deemed as out of date by Samsung!!!!!!

You wrote in your Dec 2016 issue that Samsung were supporting HLG in their 2016 models. Do you know that Samsung have supported their 2017 models but not the 2016 models. I know because the BBC IPlayer Blue Planet 2 will not play in 4K or HLG. It's not good considering Panasonic and LG both do support their 2016 models. It means my KS model I bought in Jan is now deemed out of date by Samsung. It looks like their are royalty fees which Samsung will not pay! Not good.

All you people in the UK can return your KS TVs IF you bought it for the use of the smartthings Extend that will never be coming out for our TVs. ***** is how.

Tell them you want a full refund because they promised that if you bought a KS TV you would get a FREE Smartthings Extend. They proof you will need is easy to find and is the reason you bought this TV.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMc3V98yzNY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRSWoUmU5YQ

I bought mine from J Lewis and the Samsung Extend addvert is still there https://www.johnlewis.com/electricals/samsung/smart-tv/c9601000048?rdr=1

If you bought your KS TV from currys http://techtalk.currys.co.uk/tv-gaming/tv/how-to-control-your-home-from-your-smart-tv/

They both say that you will get a free smartthings extend USB dongle.

Now send you TVs back for a full refund Smiley Happy

All those who bought a Samsung TV in 2016 may have claim for miss selling. It basically means that all you folks who bought the 2016 Samsung units have 2 choices. After Dec 2016 and if you had seen any articles that are press release's about HLG support and that influenced you decision to buy may have a case. For all those owners who read the info from the retailers on their web pages and saw and was influenced by the promise of the smart connect which has not been honoured, then you also have a case for miss selling. If you all spread this in all available media then I am sure the retailers would put pressure on to Samsung to correct this. If nothing else you could end up with nice shiny LG or Panasonic, or the new Philips that all are HLG BBC iplayer compatible, and with the HDR10 plus that again Samsung have still not implemented, you may be best with LG and Dolby Vision.

Also take a copy of the retailers web page before they change the description.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRSWoUmU5YQ

I will try to explain how to get a refund for miss selling (seen how much the LG's have come down). I followed this way and got a full refund or a JS8000.

You need to show that you asked or believed that or influenced by claims made about the capabilities of the TV. With BBC Iplayer HLG it's from the Trusted reviews and What Hi Fi, and any other publications and if you asked the retailer.

https://www.whathifi.com/advice/hdr-tv-what-it-how-can-you-get-it#6locceZo3Zf8yi5T.99

you can show you had been informed.

It's different with the smart connect as that is advertised on the main retailers web sites,

https://www.johnlewis.com/electricals/samsung/smart-tv/c9601000048?rdr=1
http://techtalk.currys.co.uk/tv-gaming/tv/how-to-control-your-home-from-your-smart-tv/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRSWoUmU5YQ

As the donngle's have not turned up you now claim miss selling, so either go to your retailer or email them with the web page, and explain why you think you were miss sold. Also phone Citizens Advice 03444 111 444 and raise a case (this also gets past on to Trading Standards). Explain that the retailer informed you off the capabilities via their web page information, and either show the page printer or the link, as above.

They will advise and link you to some template letters to send to your retailer.

I had to send a letter of intent to take legal action (template from Citizens Advice) against Curry's but then they gave me a refund.

So mention all the promises from Samsung full support for HLG, Smart Connect, and HDR10+

It will cost nothing to ask and again may bring some pressure on to Samsung.

Timdog · ‎25-07-2018

@paul1277 wrote:
@Timdog wrote:
Currys have offered me vouchers to the value of 60% of what I paid for the TV. They don’t appear to want to budge....
By offering compensation it seems to me an admittance that they are in the wrong. As we know. If they felt there was no case to answer you would be offered nothing. This a shift on their previous no. It may be worth asking where they have come up with that figure and why not a full refund as per the regs and as per what Richer Sounds are giving.
It is a shift and admittance which if it went to court would strengthen your case. As I have said before it is a case of plugging away and not let them ware you down
Paul

They basically said I’ve had use of the TV for the last two years and I failed to complain earlier.

darrant1234 · ‎26-07-2018

please reply saying you haven't had full use of the TV as you haven't been able to control smartthings from it. I did say to currys i would take a swap rather than money but said only the 2018 sets could control smart things hence getting offered a tv at 2.5k

paul1277 · ‎26-07-2018

@mrputt wrote:
Agree mate. Like yourself I have been offered a credit note of 50% of the value and return the tv or £150 cash. I have declined both offers.

Again may be worth asking how they came to that amount when the consumer regs say full refund and also that has been supported by the Richer Sounds ADR ruling.

On avoid note by offering 50% they are admitting again they are in the wrong.

Keep plugging away as a few weeks back it was just a Samsung hub they were offering.

Paul

Domaz1 · ‎26-07-2018

The percentage offers they’re making are to cover the usage of the TV. With me they started at ‘current retail value’ which was around 50% and then the in store manager increased the offer to 70%. That’s the best I managed to get out of them but haven’t accepted and am still awaiting response from their legal department in writing.

paul1277 · ‎26-07-2018

@Timdog wrote:
@paul1277 wrote:
@Timdog wrote:
Currys have offered me vouchers to the value of 60% of what I paid for the TV. They don’t appear to want to budge....
By offering compensation it seems to me an admittance that they are in the wrong. As we know. If they felt there was no case to answer you would be offered nothing. This a shift on their previous no. It may be worth asking where they have come up with that figure and why not a full refund as per the regs and as per what Richer Sounds are giving.
It is a shift and admittance which if it went to court would strengthen your case. As I have said before it is a case of plugging away and not let them ware you down
Paul
They basically said I’ve had use of the TV for the last two years and I failed to complain earlier.

Yep heard that excuss before.

Make it clear under the October 2015 European Consumer regs you can make a claim at anytime within 6 years of purchase, and under those regs an amount can be deducted for use for faulty goods after 6 months. This is not the case for misrepresentation as you have not had full use since day one. I would say you have been very patient waiting this long to be given the dongle to enable the smart hub functions that were advertised by your the retailer. Now it has been confirmed by Samsung that they will not supply the dongle, you will not be able to use the TV as advertised which is misrepresentation.

Paul

mrputt · ‎26-07-2018

Recieved another mail form Currys stating that they are unable to offer further remedies to my situation. I explained the difference between returning faulty goods and returning due to mis-representation and stated that other retailers have acknowledged this. I then recieved another response which was a copy and paste of the previous email. I've now asked for an email address of their next level of complaint.......

mrtickle · ‎26-07-2018

@mrputt wrote:
Recieved another mail form Currys stating that they are unable to offer further remedies to my situation. I explained the difference between returning faulty goods and returning due to mis-representation and stated that other retailers have acknowledged this. I then recieved another response which was a copy and paste of the previous email.

Play the same game. Keep cutting and pasting your reply which explains the difference, perhaps prefaced with "I see from your reply that you have not understood my email, so here it is again:"

mrputt · ‎26-07-2018

Final Position Email

I am sorry that we have been unable to resolve this matter to your satisfaction. We have now exhausted our internal complaints process and this is our final position.

What we cannot agree on and why

Following the purchase of a Samsung television, it was discovered that the manufacturer would not be supplying one of the features. Being beyond our reasonable control we are not willing to provide a brand new replacement television.

Our final position

In light of your situation, we are willing to provide a partial refund. The figure given is based on the price that you paid and time that you have had use of a television.

Taking your complaint further

We are obliged to inform you that you have the right to refer your complaint to an Alternative Dispute Resolution (ADR) provider. You have up to twelve months to do this.

Please find below the contact details for a certified ADR provider.

Ombudsman Services

Address:

Ombudsman Services

The Brew House

Widerspool

Greenall’s Avenue

Warrington

WA4 6HL

We need to advise you that ADR is voluntary and it is not a procedure to which we subscribe. Therefore any ADR decision would not be binding.

Yours sincerely,

Domaz1 · ‎26-07-2018

That’s the exact email I received word for word.

yannis_i · ‎26-07-2018

I have a similar email from John Lewis, with an attached Deadlock letter, if I decide to take the case to the next step, an Omnbudsman.

Interestingly, although I got the TV from Milton Keynes and I stay in London, JL mentions that they will accept Scottish legal jurisdiction. @tarbat you mentioned that JL appointed a team of solicitors based in Scotland, is that because you are based in Scotland or because they accept Scottish legal jurisdiction? Is there any difference in interpretation between Scottish law and English one, for a case like that, where Scottish law protects the retailer more? They don't say that they will accept ONLY Scottish legal jurisdiction though..

A particularly important piece of information came to me from Citizen Advice and I do not recall seing it here, but then I couldn't read all pages so apologies if it came up and was answered. They told me that even though they will refer my case to Trading Standards, a weakness in the argument for mis-representation, is the difference between a "Statement of Intent" and a "Statement of Fact". Statement of intent means that the trader had full intention to release the feature but have failed to do so, meaning no misrepresentation was made. Again, any legal expert here that could perhaps shed light if that is the case? Is this something that can win or lose an argument even in a Small Claims Court?

@JLSuccess if you have a JL case in favour of you for full refund, can you provide the Sheffield branch number you called? Your case is important in my opinion, because it shows that there is a precedent that John Lewis acted in a specific way, so acting in another way for the same case could be discrimination? Maybe I am just totally misinterpeting the law though so somebody more legally adept could clarify if that is a strong argument. However reading about Small claims, people can bring witnesses if they want to support their case. JL hasn't commented in my question if there has been a refund in the past, or omitted that reply, and obviously they will never accept any past refund in an ongoing case.

As another thought, what would happen if you accepted the Smart Hub they offer, and then prove that even with this, the TV does not act as advertised? Would you be able to still claim refund for it, not because it is misrepresented this time, but because it is a fault that will never be fixed, therefore your normal warranty can be used?